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at the top of the show, we asked you, why are you awake? producer john tower has our answers. john. >> jim writes, i bet you have no idea what position he plays. >> defensive end. come on. who are you trying to kid? so john, i've got a tweet. up early so i can start my usual commute on time and so i can cuddle with this guy. this is from elaine don. do we have the picture? aww, look at that. so cute. "morning joe" starts right now. ♪ only at the golden globes do the beautiful people of film rub shoulders with the rat-faced people of television.

>> ben's first two movies took place in boston, but he moved this one to iran because he wanted to film somewhere that was friendlier to outsiders. "hunger games" was one of the biggest films of the year and also what i call the six weeks it took me to get into this dress. >> ang li's been nominated for best director for "the life of pi" which is what i'm going to call the six weeks after i take this dress off. >> okay, they were awesome. i thought they were perfect. >> hilarious. >> they were hilarious. good morning, everyone. welcome to "morning joe." it's monday, january 14th. with us on set, we have msnbc contributor, mike barnicle. hello, mike. >> my goodness. >> what? >> when did you call him -- you said hello, mike. >> same old, same old. former treasury official and "morning joe" economic analyst, steve rattner. and "fortune" magazine's assistant managing editor, leigh gallagher is with us. hi, leigh.

>> hi. >> good to have you. >> it was a good weekend. huge weekend. you had colin powell on "meet the press." >> that was good. i was going to start with that. that was fantastic. >> then of course your biggest -- your biggest event of the weekend. miss america. miss america. >> no, not miss america. >> very excited. miss alabama. is alabama going to win everything? >> she's not from alabama. >> she actually lives in brooklyn, doesn't she? >> yeah. no, i didn't watch that. i watched "the golden globes," but i did not watch "miss america." you know how i feel about pageants. donald trump called me and left me a message saying my secret desire in life was to be a beauty queen. >> so let me ask you, was your secret desire in life when you were younger to be a beauty queen? >> no. >> you wouldn't want to do it. huffington post had an article about all the things these women did, duct tape. >> it's bad enough being on cable news. >> use duct tape and then -- >> we do that. yeah. >> miss virginia used butt glue which, by the way, would have come in handy for al roker when he went to the white house.

>> that's true. >> ba doom boom. >> what do they do at "the golden globes"? anything? >> i don't know. >> oh, my god. >> i'm in trouble again. you should also carry butt glue with you wherever he goes. let's turn the page. you just flush it right down. >> that happened. >> he gambled. he took a gamble. he played craps and lost. >> what's wrong with you? >> let's talk about the playoffs. >> what about those nfl playoffs? >> what about those falcons? >> before the falcons, what about john fox and the broncos? >> oh, my gosh. >> got 30 seconds left. he's got a time-out. he's got peyton manning at quarterback, and they take a knee? are you kidding me? >> and by the way, this play right here, my dad from the time i was 9 years old, he coached me in football. look at this. look at this! it's the keystone cops. it's the end of the game.

from the time i was 9 years old playing on his football teams, he always said the same thing. deeper than the deepest man. >> yes. >> and here they are in the nfl playoffs, end of the game, and they -- what are these guys doing? that's the end of the game. that's unbelievable. the falcons. big shock because the seahawks were supposed to win it all. >> college coach, pete carroll is a college coach trying to ice the kicker, calls the time-out just before the field goal attempt. field goal misses. he would have won the game if he weren't a college coach. >> no doubt about it. >> atlanta gets the home game next weekend. >> atlanta gets the home game against a great san francisco team. the quarterback is absolutely out of his mind, ran for 180 yards or so. >> 188 yards. >> like he was chasing a car down a highway is what somebody said. >> unbelievable. >> said he makes a new model for what a qb should be. >> absolutely. >> and then "the golden globes" last night.

>> bradley cooper got ripped off. i actually saw his movie, and i did not walk out. it's really good. >> it's really good. >> really? >> and it gets you. it's one of those movies that gets better after you left and you start thinking about it. that, to me, is a sign of -- he did a wonderful -- he got ripped off! >> he was really great. >> just amazing. "argo" won. you love "argo." >> that was great. i thought that worked. i actually watched. i'm pop cultured. >> jennifer lawrence won. >> jennifer lawrence won, yeah, definitely. >> she was wonderful. >> she was really good in that movie. >> the actress from "zero dark thirty" won. >> which i haven't seen yet. >> i haven't either. >> and the hosts were amazing. >> they were incredible. two women. >> and "les mis" which i have to see. i'm going on see more movies this year. and i'm actually going to stay in them. that's my resolution. if you'd like to join me. we're going to have, like, "morning joe" must-see movies. "les mis" sounds like one of them. >> go to the movies, the first

showing like at 10:30, quarter of 11:00 in the morning, get it out of the way. >> that and also -- >> you know what they call that? that's where all the aarp members go. >> then you go to the park. >> discount. >> the only problem is i'll see you there, barnicle. >> they have dinner right afterwards. >> the problem is you go in there and instead of selling you like the candy, they sell doan's pills and the place smells of ben gay. i like to wait at least until midafternoon. >> this is abuse. >> it is total abuse. and anne hathaway in "les mis." >> apparently her role, she talked about how she prepared for it, and she says she went to a very dark place and stayed there. >> does that sound familiar? >> yeah. >> did you watch the entire thing? >> i did that last week, by the way. i went to a dark place. >> yes, you did. >> and i've apologized to you that privately. i want to apologize on the air for going to a dark place and staying there. and i'm sorry about that.

you didn't deserve it. and i have made, like you have made a new year's resolution, to see more movies, i made three. >> what are yours? >> one, i'm not going to do that ever again. >> okay, that's good. i don't know if anyone knows what you're talking about, but that's okay. >> well, i was kind of -- i was in a bad place. >> he's got to hash something out. >> i was in a bad place. two, and this is important, too, i'm going to try to interrupt you less. in the new year. >> oh, that won't happen, but okay. >> and three, the next time we go to the white house, i'm going to try very hard not to poop my pants. >> i'd bank on one and two because i've seen you at the white house. >> what about interrupting the rest of us? where does that fit in? >> no. i mean, it's got to be "morning joe." >> all right. fine. we're good. let's do the news. >> oh. oh. >> snap. can we move on? >> yes, we can. >> former secretary of state colin powell was on "meet the press" over the weekend offering

some tough words to his own party. take a listen. >> there's also a dark -- a dark vein of intolerance in some parts of the party. what do i mean by that? what i mean by that is they still sort of look down on minorities. how can i evidence that? when i see a former governor say that the president is shucking and jiving, that's a racial-era slave term. when i see another former governor after the president's first debate where he didn't do very well says that the president was lazy, he didn't say he was slow, he was tired, he didn't do well, he said he was lazy. now, it may not mean anything to most americans, but to those of us who are african-americans, the second word is "shiftless" and then there's a third word that goes along with it, bifrter, the whole birther movement. why do senior republican leaders tolerate this kind of discussion within the party? i think the party has to take a look at itself.

i think the republican party right now is having an identity problem. and i'm still a republican. but in recent years, there's been a significant shift to the right. and we have seen what that shift has produced to losing presidential campaigns. i think what the republican party needs to do now is take a very hard look at itself and understand that the country has changed. the country is changing demographically. and if the republican party does not change along with that demographic, they're going to be in trouble. >> the next story we're about to do on gun control i think is a part of this conversation, but first, joe, how important is what colin powell said? he is someone who has endorsed president obama in the past. >> he has. >> he has shown frustration in the party, and it's not like he is mitch mcconnell or someone else saying we need to change. isn't he in a different category, or is this significant? >> it's extraordinarily significant because yes, he

supported barack obama two times. but there are a lot of other republicans that are required for a majority, that are required for republicans to win the white house that are a lot like colin powell, that just look at the republican party and think that they've lost their way. i've got to say, if you look at how the republican party reacted the first time president obama was elected, i wrote a book that basically could be boiled down to don't lose your -- al roker at the white house. >> exactly. >> they didn't listen. they went out, they engaged in birtherism, they called the president a racist who hated all white people, and they went so far right and so extreme that they lost middle america. and so yeah, we lost another presidential election. look at the cover of "drudge" which i think magnificently

reflects the feelings of conservatives, where the conservative movement is. and you know, he links stories that people want to see, and he does it better than anybody else. this weekend, i went on "drudge." and at the top of it is a story of survivalists. that are buying property, arming themselves and building walls out west. you have sean hannity who is talking about secession. you have another talk radio host whose name isn't even worth mentioning that is talking basically about -- about how the federal government is coming in and taking weapons, you know. there's a call to arms, and they're going even more extreme right than they were four years ago. this is such a recipe for disaster for the republican party. i thought i would never say it,

but if this party continues on this trajectory over the next three years, then we're going to get wiped out in '16. and if we continue on this trajectory and i think the republican party ceases to be a player in presidential politics. when a guy like colin powell, mike barnicle, says i'm a republican -- and he's been saying this for years -- and the republican party has been pushing him away, every time i talk about how our foreign policy should be like colin powell's foreign policy, for five, six years, even before he endorsed barack obama the first time, i would get attacked for associating with colin powell's very conservative with a small "c" realist approach that republican presidents followed for years. it was the weinberger doctrine. it was the reagan doctrine. it was the powell doctrine. and suddenly, it became the doctrine of lefties?

>> colin powell is a self-identified republican and has been for many, many years. and with each passing year, with each passing election cycle, the republican party, too many within the republican party, try to further estrange him from the republican party platform, from much of what is said publicly by a lot of republicans. colin powell is also a guy who has the ability and the belief that a lot of republicans -- not a lot -- but too many republicans and too many democrats don't have, he has the ability and the belief to put country ahead of party. and that's unfortunately something that's passe in washington. >> the problem, leigh, though is there are, you know, we're here in new york. or washington or boston or l.a. and the conversation's going to be different than out in the rest of the country where if you saw on the front page of "the new york times" over the weekend, this mad rush to buy guns. it's not nonexistent. they want their bushmasters. >> that's absolutely true.

but i mean, i think we're seeing the party just splinter in so many different ways. >> but that's pressure on the party. >> it is. it is. and i thought he also made a great point that, you know, the party can't lose its grip on what's happening demographically in this country. that is a tremendous deal. and this is not just the party of the wealthy, he said, and of lower taxes. it has to be, you know, many republicans don't make as much money and pay a much higher percentage of their income in taxes, and they need the party's help, too. i thought he made so many. that was such a potent -- what was it, 30 minutes? >> it really was, but mika, let's talk about the people that want to buy bushmasters. yes, gun sales are moving at a rapid pace. a lot of people are buying two or three. >> they were buying as many as they can get. >> just to keep up with their survivalist neighbors. >> right. >> you can't have enough of those clips, right? >> apparently not. >> maybe they string them around their christmas trees. i don't know what they do with them. but steve rattner, this is the

problem the republican party has made. this is the mistake the republican party's made. they listen to the loudest voices. a small, small percentage of americans. and americans, by the way, who don't swing presidential elections. i have been saying it ad nauseam for four years and making extremist conservatives very upset. you don't just look at what the most conservative person in northwest florida is going to do when they're voting. if you want to win the white house, you ask what's going to happen in bucks county, pennsylvania, what's going to happen in the suburbs of philly, what's going to happen in the i-4 corridor, in columbus, ohio. republicans chasing survivalists and the wayne lapierre fringe of the republican party, i'm not talking the nra, i'm talking the extreme fringe of the nra, that's just such a losing formula. >> yeah. so look, everything you said is

obviously completely true, and i can't disagree with it. it is at the moment a recipe for disaster. it's some kind of thelma & louise exercise where they're trying to take the party over the cliff. but i also agree, i think the colin powell performance was extraordinary. i think the way he calmly, clearly, logically -- it was just so logical from a, b to c laid out everything you just said in terms of how the republican party has moved and why it's not his party, i think there are a couple other things about the interview worth noting. one is, of course, he is to some degree still fighting the battles of the bush administration where he had that sensible, more centrist position and was fighting the neocons and for the most part probably lost. and he also has this -- you know, this particular ability to look at the situation as somebody who is a member of a minority and is trying to be a republican and feels this hostility toward him from the rest of the party, in part because he is a minority. but just to finish on a slightly more optimistic note, joe, while

at the moment it is impossible to point to any sign in the republican party that they're taking to heart the kinds of things colin powell is saying, you do remember, as you've pointed out many times on the show, that parties do have this tendency to self-correct before they self-destruct. if you look at the democratic party after 1972, it pulled itself together and eventually created the dlc. of course, after '64 nixon was able to pull the republican party back to center. >> 1984, democrats were off the deep end. and that's when bill clinton and like you said the dlc brought them together. here's the really disturbing thing. i remember, mike, back in 1995, a lot of people were talking about colin powell running for president. and i didn't want colin powell to run for president. he was a moderate. i was a conservative. but it wasn't the entire party and me against colin powell.

like there were moderates in the center of the party. and we had this very positive give and take. >> what's happened? >> this tug. >> what's happened? >> the moderates in the party have collapsed. >> where are those voices coming from? >> i am now considered by a lot of the right-wing looneys to be a moderate, to be a, quote, rino. anybody that's listened to anything i've said on taxes, on the budget, on the fiscal cliff, i mean, i think my party made a horrible mistake on the fiscal cliff, and yes, i would stare at the president on a government shutdown and say, yeah, maybe shutting down the government's reckless, but you know what's even more reckless? continuing to spend the way you and harry reid want to spend, and i'd have that battle. now, that -- the fact that a guy that carries that around as his core message, the fact that i was willing to shut down the government in 1995, and i would advise it again in 2012, if

washington doesn't get serious about curing the debt and the fact that i am considered a moderate, that should be deeply disturbing to the republican party. >> isn't that one of the key questions that republican leaders have to ask themselves? what has happened to the moderate voices in this party in that party? what has happened? you know, 15 years ago, you could have those discussions in congress in a much more amenable way. those discussions don't take place today within the republican party. look at lindsey graham. what, five, seven years ago, he could have been described as a moderate. but now because of his fear of a primary from the right, he increasingly drifts toward the right. and he's no longer a moderate voice. >> i mean, lindsey said something about like don't try to take my assault weapon away. just silly like that. >> crazy stuff. >> come on. first of all, i would like to see him try to shoot one. >> that's the reason mike said, you've got this enormous from the right coming from all these guys and ladies that if they

don't adhere to this new republican line, they're going to face a primary, get primaried. >> another big difference -- i'm sorry i interrupted you. hold on one second. >> wasn't that resolution number two? >> okay. that's okay, right? >> you're going to need a bigger paper. >> you're going to need bigger paper! all right. famous roy scheider line. the thing is, though, here's the second big point. that about 1995 and colin powell. yeah, i didn't want colin powell to be our nominee because i wanted somebody more conservative. but i respected the hell out of colin powell. and if colin powell won the nomination, i would salute instead of all these idiots -- idiots on the far right who now say if you don't agree with them on every single issue that you're a rino, you're a socialist, you're a this, you're a that, they have no idea who the ronald reagan that they once talked about was, the man who said, just because i'm your

friend 80% of the time doesn't make me your enemy 20% of the time. the reagan who came out against assault weapons, the reagan who passed tax increases when he had to pass tax increases, the reagan that was pragmatic. you don't win 49 states without being pragmatic, without figuring out, like bill buckley always said conservatives had to figure out what the reality was in front of the conservative movement. reagan figured it out. he won two historic landslides. if republicans want to win again, they're going to have to figure that out. and colin powell could actually help them out quite a bit. >> so from the logical colin powell to the completely illogical, let's end this block on the nra. following a series of meetings last week, vice president biden is set to deliver a list of comprehensive proposals to the president tomorrow. it's expected to include expanded background checks for gun buyers and the call to

reinstate a national assault weapons ban that expired in 2004. yesterday the president of the national rifle association said such a ban would not make it through congress. >> we put the brakes on is anything that simply takes away a person's second amendment right for no good reason. >> do you think you have enough support on capitol hill to keep an assault weapons ban from passing? >> i think right now we do. when a president takes all of the power of his office, if he's willing to spend political capit capital, you don't want to bet your house on the outcome. but i would say that the likelihood is that they are not going to be able to get an assault weapons ban through this congress. >> how about a clip? some kind of restriction on clips? >> i don't think ultimately they're going to get that either. >> you know, i agree with him on -- i think the assault weapon ban is going to be close. i think it could pass. i think right now it's going to be a tougher lift. i think, though, on magazines, i

think that looks -- i think that most americans support that. republicans that stand in the way of that do so at their own risk. background checks, universal background checks, that would get rid of what happens at, like, these gun shows in virginia. 80%, 85% of americans support these universal background checks. again, republican -- maybe republicans would kill that in the house. if they do, they're going to kill themselves politically. so they just have to decide whether they want to support the 1% of survivalists who believe the federal government's coming, as i said last week, to steal their chickens and take their wives, or whether they want to side with the 99% who -- or at least the 85% who agree that every american before buying a gun should have a check. >> what have they given back in this conversation? besides please, arm the schools and make them fortresses?

i'm sorry. >> the party of no. >> okay. >> the organization of no. >> it's just unbelievable. i think you're right, joe. coming up, former presidential candidate john huntman will be here. senator joe manchin of west virginia. newark mayor cory booker and former white house adviser for health policy, dr. zeke emanuel. up next, mike allen with the top stories in the "politico playbook." but first, bill karins with a check on the forecast. bill? >> good morning to you, mika. kettle corn is what i prefer for movie night, by the way. if you want me to bring that, just let me know. >> it would be awkward. >> it wouldn't be awkward. it would be enjoyable. good morning. let's talk about this weekend. the fog was incredible in new england. it's been foggy for three straight days down to the mid-atlantic. airports were a mess over the weekend. as of now they're okay. once volume increases, the visibility still very poor around philly, new york, hartford. boston and d.c. are all right,

but especially those big ar airports in the middle of i-95. through virginia and carolinas, have the umbrella with you today. it's another unusually very warm day, but that's coming to an end. look at the cold air by buffalo and pittsburgh. that's on the way for the east. in the middle of the nation, it is freezing cold this morning from chicago all the way to the west coast. frigid air, winter in full glory. look at the windchill in denver. it's minus 16. and if you watched that football game this weekend, it's been cold all weekend long. even dallas this morning with a windchill of 19. so the east coast, you're warm, you're foggy, you're wet. the middle of the country, you're cold and dry. and on the west coast, we're going to slowly recover after what was a very chilly weekend for you. i guess if there's any good news, winter kind of returns to normal around the country, but there's still no big snowstorms on the way anywhere. you're watching "morning joe." we're brewed by starbucks. i have lost 101 lbs on weight watchers online.

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29 past the hour. time now to take a look at the "morning papers." "new york times." residents of newtown, connecticut, have begun to grapple with the future of the building that housed sandy hook elementary school. some are calling to renovate and reopen the school while others want to see it demolished. the school remains a crime scene for now with only essential personnel allowed inside. and the "usa today," republican governors include louisiana's bobby jindal are championing proposals that would eliminate state income taxes in favor of boosting sales tax rates. free market economists have praised the idea, but liberal economists say poor people would be bearing the brunt of the cost because they spent a greater share of income on consumer goods. can i stop here for one second? >> uh-huh. >> steve rattner, here's a great

example. bobby jindal, like me, a really conservative guy economically. but has come out and spoken out against the stupid wing of the republican party. he's been very responsible. remember right after the election? >> yeah. >> like come on, we have got to be more inclusive, guys, and got to stop being the stupid party. here's a great example. you can disagree with bobby jindal on economics, which i'm sure you do -- >> right. >> -- because he's a lot like me, but you can respect bobby jindal as being a smart guy who wants to expand the party and be more inclusive. >> yeah. i agree. i respect him for all those things. and i think he is part of the future of the party. this particular proposal, i think what you said about it is accurate which is it does all things being equal, it's worse for poor people because they do spend more of their income, it's what we call a regressive tax. >> so you hear about lance? >> i think he's going to do oprah and tell all. >> what do you mean?

what's he going to say? >> something about, you know, not being completely candid about -- >> being 'roided out for, like, two decades? >> but they still shouldn't let him back. >> what would you do about all the people who he tried to destroy? a >> all the people he tried to destroy, all the money he got from the united states post office, all the fans he lied to, all the fans he let down, and he was so arrogant about it. >> yeah. >> you know, that's the thing about bonds. we were talking last week about the hall of fame. that's the thing about bonds and so many of these other guys. canseco came out and basically told the truth years ago. and they just turned on him and attacked him. he's an easy guy to attack, i understand. but they just lied for years. it's the arrogance. you know, pettitte, he admitted it early on. hey, i did it to get better, faster.

i made a mistake. i'm really sorry. and how do you not love andy pettitte? you forgive him, right? >> absolutely. >> but clemens, a jerk. >> yeah. rafael palmeiro pointing at the hearing. >> you just think about all these bans, you know. every one of those livestrong bands that was sold to young kids, to all of us everywhere, it's just unbelievable. it's going to be a big ratings coup for oprah's network. >> yes, it will. >> that's for sure. let's get to "politico." with us who you, chief white house correspondent for "politico," mike allen with the "playbook." >> he admitted early on to "the washington post" he had been 'roided out, look at him. he survived, and now he runs the most important segment i think in morning news. >> there's life after 'roids, mike. >> you did lose all your hair. >> a small price to pay. >> exactly, for those muscles. so this morning as part of your

behind-the-scenes curtain series, "politico" is reporting that house republicans are talking about -- and this was a fascinating story when it went up this weekend -- talking about a default, very bad idea, i think, or shutting down the government, not quite as dangerous, over the debt limit. tell us what you found out. >> yeah, joe, this column, "behind the curtain," is going to be a real cold shower for a lot of people in d.c. jim vandehei, jake sherman and i found out that the possibility of a shutdown or even default, much more likely than anyone in washington thinks. by some of the preliminary counts, by the house republican leadership, more than half their members would be willing to go into default. 90% of members are fine with the sequester automatic spending cuts going in. so starting today, leadership is meeting in a retreat out in the virginia horse country. they're talking about how to manage this. this could be a public relations nightmare, especially the

default part of it. so they're going to try and educate their members about exactly what it would mean if they didn't raise the debt ceiling. but what republicans say to us is, this is all we can do to get president obama's attention. so one possibility that we report here on "politico" for the first time, speaker boehner's chief of staff, mike connors, has talked about the idea of only raising the debt ceiling for one to three months. the way they explained this to us is, if we get cuts for one month, if we get cuts for two months, three months, that's how much we'll raise the debt ceiling. so republicans coming into the year are playing very hardball. >> mike allen. >> can i ask steve really quickly -- i know we've got to go -- steve, obviously if you have government shutdown, there are services that are. soed, and that can be very tough. that's not as bad as a default, right? if we don't increase the debt limit, which, i mean, i voted against when i was in congress.

but that's much more troublesome -- >> a default would be a disaster. a government shutdown is part of the give and take we've seen go on over 20 years. this is just another example of republicans heading for their own cliff of their own making. coming up, a wild weekend of nfl playoff action including incredible comebacks by the falcons. >> now, if you have a wild weekend, what do you want to have here? somebody who's mad. somebody who's crazy. >> a mad dog. >> the doggy's here. >> the dog is in the house. >> mad dog russo joins us next on set.

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13 seconds left. 49 yards away for matt bryant. from the right hash. good snap. good hold. and it is good! >> wow! >> not bad. >> with us now, chris russo. he has his own channel on sirius xm. >> mad dog. >> it's ugly. it's called mad dog radio. i listen to it all the time. a lot of screaming, crying, wailing at children. >> very loud. >> it's very loud. >> enthusiastic. >> i drive around my hometown. >> we see each other all the time. how are you? >> so i'll be listening to mad

dog screaming. >> you see each other at an undisclosed place. >> yes. >> it can't be mentioned out loud. mad dog tends to blurt it out once in a while. >> don't blurt it out. so mad dog. i've suffered with the falcons for a long time. i've got to be honest, when matt ryan had the second half that he had, i said this guy just can't win the big game. he's just not a we were. >> then he makes two big plays. >> then he makes two big passes. man, i tell you what, the coach and the quarterback's short-term at least legacy were on the line on that last drive. >> i agree. >> it would be a long off-season for them. >> falcons had to win the game, 27-7 lead in the fourth quarter. you cannot lose that game under any circumstances. as you said, they got out of rhythm offensively. >> matt ryan terrible in the second half. >> throws an interception. seattle comes down the field. seattle does a terrible job. you've got 28-27 lead. 31 seconds left. you cannot give up a field goal.

and bryant's a good kicker. it's indoors. he's going to make that kick lots of times as you see, and seattle does a great job of getting back in the game. hey, atlanta's going to lose to san francisco. i do not like atlanta in this next game. because they don't have a big defense. and you cannot let a rookie quarterback, 27 points in the fourth down the stretch in the game. >> how big would russell wilson be if he played for an east coast team? >> he's big anyway. nfl, you can play anywhere and still be big. it's a tremendous job by the seahawks to get back in this game. remember the first half they had all the fumbles, missed the field goal. >> help me out here. the falcons -- first of all, mike barnicle, we love pete carroll. >> called the time-out, can't call a time-out. he's annoyed that he had the practice kick. that's why he's yelling at the official. >> gives him a second chance, this time it goes straight through the middle. can you tell me, though, what in the world happened on the

ensuing kickoff? >> stupid. >> what were the falcons doing? on-side kick? >> i guess they said that he didn't execute it properly. kicked the ball deep. he's not going to run it back for a touchdown. they give the ball up midfield with seven or eight, give him a couple plays. very poor job done by the falcons. i do not like atlanta next week. >> you know, though, here's the thing about the falcons. we heard a lot of people say the seahawks were going to win -- joey scarborough and nate silver both predicted the seahawks were going to win the super bowl. >> a lot of people liked them. >> the falcons won. i remember when the falcons played the giants earlier in the year. the giants were going to blow them out. >> be careful. >> no, i'm just telling you -- >> that quarterback, kaepernick, is good. they got a good defense. harbaugh is a good coach. we see him on the road now, but harbaugh is a good coach. san francisco -- i think it's going to be san francisco and new england. i'm sick of ray lewis, but i'd like to see baltimore -- >> why are you sick of ray lieu

dismiss. >> oh, enough of ray lewis. gosh almighty. enough. nobody wants to hear from ray lewis anymore. america has had enough of ray lewis. he's not the spokesman of the team. please, enough of ray lewis. >> let's talk quickly, ray lewis is going to the afc championship game because the defensive backs for the denver broncos didn't learn what, again, as i was saying, my daddy taught me when i was 9 years old, deeper than the deepest man. and here they are at the end of the game. >> look at this. >> end of the game! >> absolutely absurd. ties the game up. >> you've got the safety, they're stumbling over each other. how do you not have somebody behind me? sloo ve >> very good point. don't forget denver gave up a touchdown at the end of the first half which they shouldn't have done, and on third and 13 in overtime, baltimore from their own 3 yard line, they gave up a first down. >> what is that? >> that's a terrible play. >> in pee-wee league. >> let's give manning grief here, not just on this play. man had gone a terrible football game. he had three turnovers.

he audibled into a run on third and seven late in regulation. he's 9-11 in the playoffs. he's not tom brady. he's supposed to be an immortal. an immortal doesn't lose 11 playoff games. give him grief here, too. >> you look at that score, he put 39 points on the board. >> 21 because they had the two touchdowns. >> no, he didn't. one punt return, one kickoff return. i tell you what. twitter was afire when somebody -- i think chuck todd made the suggestion that tim tebow has a better winning percentage in the playoffs. >> that was a little strong. everybody in denver now. remember about manning. i don't want to pick on -- you can't kill him too much, he had a great year, he's 9-11 in the postseason. brady's 17-6. he has lost eight first-round playoff games. this is supposed to be an immortal. >> he's 0 for 4 when the weather is under 40 degrees. >> that's another little stat you don't like. and he did not play well against the ravens. he can say anything he wants. the defense takes all the hits, rightfully so, as you said, but

he did not play well. >> the nfl would have loved a peyton/brady showdown. >> cbs wanted brady and manning, 6:40 on sunday night, they didn't get it. >> let's talk about san francisco. what a game. >> their offense is superb. let me give mccarthy grief on two things, the packer coach. third quarter, 24-21, a fourth and two at the niner 11 yard line. his defense hasn't stopped them all night. you've got to go for a touchdown. he kicked a field goal. that's a mistake. number two with 11 minutes left, down by two touchdowns at midfield, fourth and two and he punts. they haven't stopped him the whole game. kaepernick's running all over the place. >> and the other run for the touchdown was insane. >> 188 yards total. >> and did you know, out of 180 of the 188 yards total -- >> look at this one. >> this is a pass play. to crabtree. not touched. >> he was not touched. >> the kid had a great game. and san francisco, give harbaugh credit. you know, he benched alex smith because of the concussions. he put kaepernick in there,

thinking he could win a big playoff game, and kaepernick is playing very well. again, i think san francisco and new england, i think that would be a pretty good super bowl. they play in the regular season. i think -- the niners this week. >> new england, unbelievable. they are on fire. >> consistent. >> thanks to you and your outdoor voice. very nice. >> all right, mad dog! love it. up next, jonathan capehart -- i'm exhausted. >> revived. that's the idea. we'll be right back with your "must-read opinion pages." [ male announcer ] you are a business pro.

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all right. welcome back to "morning joe." 49 past the hour. a live look at washington, d.c. as you wait for the sun to come up. it's time to wake up, everyone. here with us now, pulitzer prize-winning editorial writer for "the washington post "skpoi

m sch and msnbc contributor, jonathan capehart. >> good morning. >> by frank bruni, democrats behaving badly. he writes, in part, this. "democrats came out of the 2012 elections looking good, and the country's changing demographics suggest that they could come out of 2016 and beyond looking even better, especially if republicans don't accomplish a pretty tough image overhaul. and that overhaul isn't exactly proceeding at a breakneck pace. if its foes were smart and humble, they'd do what a sports team with a big lead does. they'd play error-free ball, not harry reid and not president obama whose recent actions have been careless, at best, and cavalier at worst. just before and after the 2012 election, it looked as if republicans might successfully be burying themselves. all democrats had to do was hammer the nail in the coffin. but the way they're behaving, they'll raise the dead. you think that's fair? >> well, i think it's a warning.

>> they're not taking perfect advantage. >> yeah, i think it's a warning. jonathan, of course, you always have parties that do well and then overreach. i guess frank's just warning democrats not to be too cavalier and seem gracious in victory. >> i suppose, but i wonder, you know, what does frank want the democrats and the president to do? especially since -- i mean, i would understand that if we weren't facing not the fiscal cliff, but the debt ceiling crisis that's about to come up. the sequester crisis that's about to come up. the continuing resolution crisis that's about to come up. and they're going to have to be hard negotiations back and forth between the two sides. i mean, i hear this line of argument not just from frank bruni but from others including democrats. and i sit there and think, well, what do you expect the president to do? and democrats on the hill to do when faced with a republican opposition that doesn't -- that doesn't want to seemingly compromise? >> so frank's point is that the democrats, like harry reid, instead of getting out of the

way and letting the republicans destroy themselves, harry reid will go on the senate floor and be unnecessarily provocative, rub their noses in it. frank doesn't talk about this, but other democrats have even brought up the president's press conference while he was in the middle of negotiations. >> right. >> with the cheerleaders. it was very interesting, having pom-poms saying rah-rah reid. >> pom-poms were missing. >> a lot of people say that's unnecessarily provocative. again, i'm just, you know, lending support to frank's argument here. do you think maybe the president -- the democrats need to be more gracious and just let the republicans destroy themselves while they're smiling from the sidelines? >> you brought up two instances when there are hundreds of thousands of instances that happen every day that we don't know about of graciousness and things like that. you know, harry reid, i'm not a big harry reid fan. i think sometimes he goes way too far and isn't terribly

effective leader, but i do think we are getting to a point where, you know, democrats and republicans are going to have to come together and stop posturing, come together, to come up with the ideas that are going to move this country forward because those three deadlines i brought up, they're coming up quickly. something's going to hit the controlling in mid-february. >> it does have to be done together. a grand bargain was never going to happen because of all the things we've been discussing. you know, i think this was a contrarian piece. this is something people haven't really been pointing out. but i think the blame lies really everywhere as we've been discussing. you know, colin powell, one of the things he said, he said i came of age in the party of weinberger and george h.w. bush and richard lugar. the compromise has long, long gone. >> and i've got to say, for the white house, it's been frustrating at times. you know, i've been very

critical of the president for not reaching out more in negotiations to, say, john boehner. but the president's invited john boehner and other republicans to state dinners. he's invited them to other events. for the most part, they just refuse. they refuse to go to the white house because they believe it will hurt them to be seen at the white house? they're doing the country's business. and you've got the president of the united states, and it doesn't matter whether you disagree with him, you've got to meet with the president and talk to the president and deal with the president. >> it's so very different from how we used to do things. bob dole and george mitchell used to have dinner together once a week to talk about doing business together. it's what was done. >> it takes two. >> and they disagreed. >> leigh, thank you very much. good to have you on this morning. still ahead, former governor jon huntsman, newark mayor cory booker and dr. zeke emanuel. we'll be right back with much more "morning joe." with the spark cash card from capital one,

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coming up next, it's a no-labels convention. mark mckinnon joins us along with former presidential candidate john hun huntsman and senator joe manchin. a lot of stars in the house. we're back in a moment. at a dry cleaner, we replaced people with a machine.

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♪ those hollywood nights kathryn bigelow nominated tonight. i haven't really been following the controversy over "zero dark thirty," but when it comes to torture, i trust the lady who spent three years married to james cameron. >> anne hathaway, you gave a stunning performance in "les miserables." i have not seen someone so totally alone and abandoned like that since you were on stage with james franco at the oscars.

>> aww. they were funny. >> they were great. >> they were perfect. >> they're always perfect. they're always great. >> welcome back to "morning joe." top of the hour. joining us on set, look at this. former adviser to president george w. bush -- >> everybody's got buttons on. >> you want to know what it says? >> what's it say? >> i have to look at it. problem solver. committed to fix. >> that's me. >> not fight. >> not fight. not fight. we cleared that up this morning. so we've got mark mckinnon here. >> yes. are you going to fix and not fight? okay. former republican governor -- >> we are thanks to these two guys. >> former presidential candidate jon huntsman and democratic senator of west virginia, senator joe manchin. >> two of my favorite guys. let's start, colin powell, on "meet the press" yesterday. here's a guy that was in the mainstream of the republican party not so long ago. he said the party abandoned him. i was pleased to hear him say he still identifies himself as a republican.

i think the fact he's still holding on, clutching, that's a good thing. >> that's a good thing, joe. that's a good thing. >> but i would guess, like me, you agreed with a lot of the things he said yesterday. >> i did. i remember sitting at that convention. mark will remember this, too, in philadelphia in 2000. and the name colin powell came over the roster as a possibility for secretary of state, and the place lit up and went nuts. the prospect of getting colin powell on your team to take a leadership role, how inspiring was that? he's still around and he still inspires a whole lot of people. there might be 10% who give the rino calls, but there are a whole lot of other people saying what he is saying carries some real truth. >> here's colin powell on "meet the press" yesterday talking about what the party needs and quite frankly his own identity crisis given the state of the republican party. take a look. >> i think the republican party right now is having an identity problem. and i'm still a republican. but in recent years, there's been a significant shift to the right. and we have seen what that shift

has produced. two losing presidential campaigns. i this i what the republican party needs to do now is take a very hard look at itself and understand that the country has changed. the country is changing demographically. and if the republican party does not change along with that demographic, they're going to be in trouble. >> the party has changed, jon huntsman. it's changed from when i got elected, from when you got elected. guys like us used to be called conservatives. >> right. >> now, again, you've got the extremists, the nuts in the party that will say you're a rino. i'm a rino because we don't hate. you had and erick erickson have said it, the most conservative record of anybody in the republican nomination process. and yet stylistically, because you didn't call barack obama a socialist, you were a rino. i mean, this is not a party -- last year at least -- that was

serious about winning. >> exactly. >> it's a wacky period. and i think the good news is the party, if it gets a vision, and if it gets a big, bold, optimistic view of where this nation needs to go, we'll come back. i mean, these cycles occur. that's the good news. but what joe manchin, my great friend, we were governors together, are just as interested in because the party is going to rebuild. it will go up and down. there will be cyclicality. what we're making sure is that whether democrat or republican people in congress actually start problem solving and getting the work of the american people done. because it seems that congress has given up on the american people, but the american people haven't given up on congress. there's still a pretty optimistic burchg onch out ther they want results and they're getting nothing. let's start with the basics. how do you start problem solving, right, joe? >> that's right, jon. i'm just so delighted to be part of this with jon. and the problem solving. i was with you at the first meeting two years ago here in new york, if you recall, and

y'all made your appearance, i got to meet you for the first time. basically, we were frustrated. we came in as governors in 2004. the first thing we did, we started having national governors association meetings. so our families, our wives, we knew each other. we talked about the problems and the challenges. we talked about our successes, and we shared that. and i thought, you know, that theme is going to carry through. it would carry through when i went to senate. i got to the senate and found out it wasn't the same. so i got frustrated and i came to -- >> how different is it, running west virginia with democrats and republicans and being in washington, d.c.? >> well, basically what we did is we put our state first all the time. we'd call everybody together, democrats and republicans. i'd go into both caucuses and talk to them. one time i went into the republican caucus as a democrat and they said what are you doing here, joe? i said the last time i checked, i took an oath of office. and i think we have the same constituent base, to serve everybody. and we took that approach, and that's how we governed. then i come here and i found it

to be so divisive. i told jon, would you believe that i've been in senate for two years and we have not had the first bipartisan caucus where democrats and republicans in the senate -- >> are you serious? >> -- sat down and talked. two years i've been there. there hasn't happened. >> and people come up to you, actually, don't they? because i know they'd come up to me and they'd go, hey, joe, there's a party-line vote. you've got to be with the party. >> the first time that was said to me. >> that never worked with me. i guess it didn't work with you. >> i looked at it, joe, and i said that might be a party-line vote, but it's not a west virginia-line vote. i can't explain it back home. if i can't explain it, i'm not going to vote for it. i think i was there basically if my country does well, my state's going to do well and the people in my state will do very well. and i'm going to put my country above my party. i have said that. i'm a proud west virginia democrat. i don't think i'm a maybe washington democrat. >> so mark mckinnon, how do we take this to the next level? >> the practical approach that we're taking is that we're trying to identify -- or we have

identified 25 problem solvers in the congress and the senate. people who signed up -- >> we've got 25. >> we've got 25. we're rolling them out today. we think we'll get to 75 very quickly. as you know, joe, a coalition of that number, you get to 25 or 40 members that can come together and are committed to meeting once a month, republicans and democrats, start a dialogue, that's such a low bar, but as the senator just happened. he's been there two years. this group is committed to meeting once a month. we think once the word gets out today, we'll have people flocking to join us and we'll get to 75 quickly. remember the old blue dogs was only 40 and they had a big impact. so when you have that number, the leadership will come to that group. both leadership, republican and democrat, to move on these big issues. this is just going to start greasing the engine to get it moving again. >> in the house, there's a 16-vote majority. >> there you go. that's right. that's what i'm saying. >> you need 17 votes to make a difference in the house. >> in the senate, it's 15. >> the senate is 15. >> jon huntsman. >> here's why this is so timely.

businesses are ready to reinvest in this country. manufacturing is beginning to come back. we've got the prospects for an energy revolution, the likes of which we couldn't even imagine a few short years ago. and when the dysfunction of congress becomes the dysfunction of this nation and businesses begin to hold back on the energy that they're about to plow into our tomorrow for the next generation, that's when you know you've got a problem. so all of this work around energy policy, immigration policy, budgets balanced by a can-do problem-solving coalition, it's critically important and timely. >> the greatest challenge the american economy has is the american congress. >> you know, it is. it really is, if you look at what's happening out there. and i've been saying this. and you guys have been saying it, too. because you go out and you talk to americans and they're discouraged by what's going on. and you say, wait a second. guys, we're in a century right now with the most technologically advanced country with the greatest universities, the greatest schools, we're going to win.

>> that's right. >> even the chinese say america has eight out of the top ten universities on the planet. as you said, we've got energy. and you know this better than anybody else. there have been surveys. you ask chinese students what their biggest complaint about their education is, and they go, that our teachers don't teach us how to think like americans. >> that's right. >> they're crazy, those americans, and we want to have some of that. and you talk about -- you talk about this energy revolution, and americans need to hear this. >> it's right there. >> we have -- >> within our grasp. >> -- an extraordinary opportunity. the natural gas revolution. the fact in 2020, we're going to be the top producer of oil on the planet. you look at technology. you look at all the opportunities. like joe said, the only thing standing in our way is washington, d.c. from the next american century. and that's not jingoism. it's all out there for americans to see if washington can get on

board! >> that's it. so we've got the politics of left, we've got the politics of right, and we've forgotten the most important politics of all, and that's the politics of problem solving for the american people. that's what we're going to hit home today with great problem solvers from congress and 1,500 volunteer activists on their own dime coming to town just to be part of it. >> you've also cowritten a piece in "the washington post," "turning washington's partisans into problem solvers." "from our perspective, there's only one way for leaders in washington to step up: they need an attitude adjustment. everyone needs to be willing to sit down with anyone -- conservative, liberal or anyone in between -- to work together to achieve success for our nation. everyone needs to recognize that principles and deeply held political beliefs don't require an all-or-nothing approach to governance and that the letter behind a person's name does not automatically make them stupid or treasonous. to be clear, we are not new

nieve about fostering cooperation across the aisle. there are philosophical differences between democrats and republicans that can't be papered over with nice words about civility. but adopting an attitude focused on problem solving is a deeply pragmatic response to washington's dysfunction." and joe manchin, i think of this, doesn't this sound great, joe? it makes a lot of sense. and then i think about the gun debate. and i think about all the people who went out to buy their bushmasters quickly before the laws change against them. i mean, there is the concept of problem solving. >> let me just say on what you just read. i just told you about the senate. we have not had a bipartisan caucus, to talk to our colleagues just in the senate. democrats and republicans. we do it and get together with a few of our friends here and there and talk about what our differences may be. you can just imagine, we didn't even know who our colleagues were on congress, over across the hall. >> right. >> by not knowing that, problem solvers is the first venue. problem solvers basically with no labels put together the

problem-solving group. it's the first time i had a chance to in two years to meet some of my colleagues on congress and be able to have a serious dialogue. what are our differences? what can you get through on your side? how can we work together before you send us something that we can't pass on our side? you know how that works, joe. >> oh, yeah. >> and we had that dialogue. this is the first venue that we've had. that's why i'm so excited about no labels. >> mark, we talk about tip o'neill and ronald reagan all the time and the example that they give. let's talk about when you were working for george w. bush. i remember in 2001 after teddy kennedy said a lot of ugly things about george w. bush, and i'm sure he returned the favor in fund-raising letters that you guys sent out. the president calls him to the white house early on to watch a movie with him. then they talk about education reform. a few years later, ted kennedy, in the middle of the iraq war, says, i think, some absolutely nasty things about george w. bush. is the favor returned? they invite teddy kennedy, you

know, to austin, texas, or to george h.w. bush's library and the family is there, and kennedy returned the favor. it's like you can get tough. you can even get ugly, but you get to stay in the game and talk to people who you -- nobody disagreed with george w. bush more than teddy kennedy. >> exactly right. >> teddy kennedy and george w. bush never made it personal. got ugly, got angry, but it wasn't personal in the end. >> they passed the most historic education laws that we've had in a century. and it shows the value of investing in relationships. you know, i think people kind of scoff at that a little bit, but it's true when you actually meet with each other and get to know each other, it's a lot harder to demonize the other people. and you can start to understand where people are coming from and what they need in order to get something passed. >> and mark, by the way, and people do scoff at this. and you know who scoffs at this? idiots scoff at this that have

never run a business, that have never been in a good relationship, that have never realized that no matter what you do, there has to be a give and take, back and forth. >> exactly right. >> knees guys understand it because they were governors. there's some people in washington, a lot of bloggers, a lot of people on tv, a lot of people on talk radio that scream. but if you're actually doing the people's business, you've got to work. >> you do. >> at relationships constantly. >> joe, the whole thing about that i've said and jon and i have talked about this is when we were governors, if we need to get something passed and we had let's say like a teddy kennedy on the other side saying things, you had to figure how to give them a comfort level. figure out where they're coming from. how could they go home and defend themselves? once you put yourself in your so-called opposition's position -- >> right. >> -- give them some comfort to meet you somewhere. we're not seeing that today. it's just basically because with the media hype, if you will, and no pun intended, or basically the money that's involved right now, and jon and i both said, the right and the left is driving it.

that's where the money's coming from and the people that are all excited on the far right or the extremes on the left. and those in the middle are saying, i'm okay with my life. everything's okay. i'm not going to get involved. and it's just hard. it's just hard to get people to come over. and we're saying, no labels is going to give them a home. if you want to solve a problem, if you're as frustrated as i am and you know the place should work and can work, but we've got to work on relationships, joe, we're there three days a week. what's wrong with a five-day workweek? >> what's wrong with passing -- >> a budget. >> that's on our agenda is a five-day workweek. >> how about no budget, no pay. give me a break. >> it's a mind set that governors have to have. when i first got to congress, i had a guy that would antagonize my constituents. and he would send me letters. i won't say what he was. so i would look and say, i'm not going to send this to my constituents. and finally i said okay, here's an exercise. and i'd just do a smiley face.

i want you to look at this letter. i want you to find one thing that i agree with. and i want you to write an entire letter about that. and we'd negotiate and i negotiated with bill clinton and the administration over long-term care. and what you do is you walk into the room, and you say, what do you need? what's the first thing i would always say. and i know you guys, what do you need at the end of the day? what do you need? and i'll tell you what i need and let's help each other. we both want to pass this. in my case, it was that federal employees had access to long-term care. i'd say, what do you need? they'd tell me what they needed. i said, i can't give you all of that. here's what i need. they'd go, i can't give you all that. and you sit there, and it took six months, nine months, a year. but we finally got there. it's all -- as joe said, it's all attitude, man. it's all attitude. >> it's an attitude that speaks to problem solving. heaven forbiforbid, the next generation grow up think what they're seeing in washington today is the norm.

it isn't. this isn't the way the system is supposed to function. the 112th congress was the most dysfunctional in the history of this country. >> the important thing is you've got to mean something. >> poisonous insects. yeah. >> i mean, i think that if you really need spending cuts, then you ought to ask for them. do you really think that the democrats didn't say, during the last crisis, what do you need? i mean, we were -- they were -- they didn't get what they needed because they don't really want it. >> and here's a great example, actually, of how not talking, how republicans, we're talking about john boehner who went to a state dinner meeting. because john boehner didn't have a relationship with barack obama. when barack obama got on "meet the press" sunday morning and said yeah, we'll make adjustments to how we pay out social security. and then harry reid in the afternoon said no, we're not going to, if john boehner had a relationship like tip o'neill had a relationship with ronald reagan, they'd pick up the phone and say listen, here's the deal. i'll bring you the votes you need, but listen, you're going

to have to tell harry reid to back off. okay, mr. president? we're not going to show you up. you said it this morning on "meet the press." we need that. give me that, and we'll get a vote on the floor and we'll pass this thing. but instead, there was no relationship. so they talked past each other. it was shortsighted and ended up costing taxpayers a lot of money over the next 10, 20 years. >> mika, those were forced meetings just behind the very top of the leadership ladder. what we're talking about is bringing together the constituent members on a monthly basis so they can have dialogue well before we come to the kreis point. >> it doesn't cost a thing to become a member. just go on nolabels.org. >> you are so good. >> let's go. i've got to thank joe manchin because joe manchin did something that nobody on the planet could do for me. he takes me down on the field in the orange bowl, and he goes, come on. we're going to meet coach saban. and seriously, i was lagging

behind. i have no fear. but he kept walking, kept turning around, where you going? dude, i know nick saban. i mean, i don't know him, but i know who he is. that's like sticking your arm, you know, in a pit bull's face. i was, like, i'm not interrupting this guy before the game because i've seen him. he don't talk to anybody. >> oh, no. >> he's in the zone. seriously, it was like intimidating. come to the end zone. by the players. what are you doing, man? and so i finally go over there. he's, like, come on, joe. he grabs me. >> he's bashful. >> nick saban sees him, runs off the field, gives him a big hug. you guys are like brothers. >> grew up together, i've known him since i was 4 years, best person in the world, my dear friend. >> very focused. >> very focused. >> i got him to smile. i got a little worried, like mushy. >> he's like a coach, too. his attitude, very much like a coach. >> gentlemen, governor huntsman and senator joe manchin.

>> two of the great guys. hey, these are not two of the good guys, these are two of the great guys who put america first. very conservative republican. and yet, you're always willing to reach across the aisle, man. thank you for being here. >> that's what the people want. >> and joe, you know nick saban. one of the great guys! >> mark mckinnon, stay with us. up next, newark mayor and perhaps future senator from new jersey, cory booker joins us on set. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. i was overweight my whole life. i obsessed about my weight my whole life. i figured i was just born that way. i was always on some new, life-stopping diet. and then, weight watchers. it lets me be me. and i naturally became a healthier me. i amazed myself. get used to it.

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the idea that you have not really worked out with senator lautenberg what his plans are, any missteps in terms of that? >> no, again, this is really early. we've reached out to him. i even had a trip to speak with him, but he wasn't able to speak. this campaign is over a year away. you know new jersey's got to

focus on a governor's race and legislative race. but for me to do it, a good exploration to do due diligence -- >> but you're not ruling out challenging him? >> i'm not ruling anything out right now but i think it's premature to be speculative. >> welcome back to "morning joe." with us now, democratic mayor of new jersey, cory booker. >> today i'm no labels. >> you're no labels before no labels was cool. >> really? good to have you back on the show. >> we're talking about football, alabama. >> how could you not mention stanford at all? >> stanford is a great success story. here you have one of the top programs that still has a great football program, how do you do that? >> when i was at stanford, i was helping to recruit more players. the coaches put down the top 100 recruits. they said 88 of those we can't touch because they can't get in academically. every year stanford wins the cup for the most ncaa championships, diversity of sports. we are an athletic powerhouse.

we don't get that respect but we do it the right way. what's happening in college athletics which is terrible -- and you see this with hall of fame voting -- it's turning from a game about teaching character, about values to win at any cost, and that's wrong for america. and so i'm proud of stanford the standard they're setting and that they're winning with that philosophy is incredible. >> it really is. notre dame also, you've got to tip your hat to notre dame, a great school, a great academic tradition. and yeah, they lost the national championship to my alma mater, but guess what, man. they were number one at the end of the season. and academically, fantastic. >> incredible. i always say back in the '80s, i was an all-american. the older i get the better i was, so take a grain of salt with that. >> you played with knute rockne. >> the reality was, only a few schools even made me fill out an application. but notre dame had me come in

and go through an academic requirements, duke university made me come in and go through academics and stanford did as well. the rest of the schools just sort of came in and waved me through. >> let's follow up with a clip from "meet the press." you were talking about possibly running for senator. a lot of people very excited about that prospect. frank lautenberg's aide sort of zinged you. are you waiting for the senator to make up on his mind on whether he runs or will you make the decision independently of his plans? >> as you know, i made a decision not to run for governor, to focus on the end of my term. that's really what my focus is. this is going to be my most productive year as mayor. we've got about $1 billion of new investment coming into newark. we'll have a city balanced budgeted for the first time in a decade or two. we're going to also be hiring for police officers. that's my focus. i have to file that account, as you probably know, because i can't even do research on a federal office without having a federal account. >> right. >> for the rest of it, i think a lot's going to happen during this state election year. i'll let that happen.

but my intention is to run for senate, but i'm going to let -- it's still in the preliminary stages and i'll let things happen that should happen. the focus frankly for all of new jersey should be our two senators, supporting them in fiscal cliff negotiations, sandy relief, debt ceiling. we should be support frank lautenberg, supporting bob menendez. and i have a big job to do here in newark. >> i want to ask you about guns. you've spoken about closing loopholes. you also said it has to be all-inclusive legislation that includes mental health. my worry is change will get bogged down with all the details that are lumped into something. if there was one gun-control measure that you say had to happen, what would it be? >> so this is really my worry right now. is that the gun conversation is being spread out and diffuse. we need to understand that there are murders every single day in america. over 30 murders a day. we have a virginia tech all around. and it's grievously painful what happened in connecticut, but

mayors of big cities see this kind of heinous violence every single day. and instead of dividing ourselves as a country along partisan lines, let's come back to what is most pragmatic, what will keep people safe in america that most americans, that over 80% of gun owners in america, that 74% of nra members in america agree, there are changes that all of us agree on -- >> give us examples. >> the two best examples is right now if you are on the terrorist no-fly list in america, remember mumbai's terrorist attacks was not bombs. they were automatic weapons. if you were on the terrorist no-fly list, you can't get on a plane, but you could go to gun shows in america, you can go to the private market, internet sales and buy trunkload full of weapons. >> by the way, that's not hyperbole. you can literally go to gun shows if you're on the terrorist no-fly list and buy a trunkload worth of guns. >> assault weapons. >> fill your car up with assault weapons. who's for that? >> nobody's for that. >> survivalists.

but other than survivalists, who is for that? >> so what i know, this is the data. when i saw the heller decision come down, which banned -- overturned the ban on handguns, and i'm like wait a minute. as a mayor, let me look at the data. i could only find one shooting in my city with a law-abiding citizen used a gun, and that was a corrections officer. >> that's exactly the point. you said before, most murders in this country are committed with handguns, not with assault rifles. and yet we're not even having a conversation about handguns at the moment. it is off the table. it's not something that anyone thinks is even -- >> as you and i know, it's less than 10% -- it's a small fraction of the shootings that are with assault weapons. i'll give you a great data example. this is mayors against illegal guns. i just want to give praise to mike bloomberg, the obi-wan kenobi who pulled this all together in a coalition.

>> does he have any idea who obi-wan kenobi is? >> probably not. >> probably not. he probably owns the movie company. has no idea who obi-wan kenobi is. >> i think he'll think it sounds good to me. >> mike's best advice i've ever heard is before you become a mayor, you should become a billionaire. >> 24 times over. >> but the point is, the data that we did as mayors against illegal guns researching the problem, in states that have cracked down on secondary markets, gun shows, private sales, et cetera, if a woman is murdered in this country, one out of two of those women are murdered by somebody they know. and intimate. and by the way, if you have a misdemeanor charge of domestic violence, you can't buy a gun which i think is reasonable. and what they do is as soon as they cut down on secondary markets, those women being murdered by their intimate -- did goes down 40%. >> it's the giuliani argument on crime. you know, the whole broken windows argument. you take care of the misdemeanors, and soon you rack up felonies. >> if we just did a good job in

this country on two things, you're going to make newark safer, new york city safer, you're going to make america safer. one is background checks. the federal instant background check, make that universal for all gun prchls. and number two -- >> 85% of gun owners support that. >> over 80% of gun owners agree with that. number two is making sure that every state -- virginia had to go through this the tough way after virginia tech, they suddenly said you know what? we need to make sure that we're reporting mental health issues. people with mental health bars into the federal database. because there's about 19 states right now that have a less than 100 people reported into that database. >> and mark mckinnon, also, another issue that -- the overwhelming majority of americans support and gun owners are the high-capacity magazines. three out of four americans, you know, and as joe mentioned -- as joe mentioned, find somebody that tells you they need a magazine that will hold more than ten bullets, and ask them why they need that. why? >> that and those two items you mentioned, none of those are an assault on the second amendment.

>> by the way, scalia said as much in heller. >> yeah. and my advice to republicans is to be for something, not just to roll up the drawbridge and say we're against everything. it could be a three-point plan or two of those things. something. >> i was so disappointed for many reasons. but he could have taken the national conversation, focused it in on what his membership agrees with and turn it into one of the most important leaders -- >> and it would have gotten so much more credibility. >> i would have supported it. >> you know why he didn't? >> why didn't he? >> because it's not about -- >> it's not about his membership. >> it's not about his membership, it's about the money. it's the gun manufacturers. everyone's about the membership. if he was listening to 80% of gun owners that believe in universal background checks, he would have come out and supported that. if he was listening to three out of four americans and gun owners, but it's about making money for guns --

>> clearly. >> he doesn't reach any other conclusion. >> this is why no labels is so important. right now our elected leaders in this country hide in the shadows of letting these interest groups control them and not where pragmatic politics. i could go through name ruumero like why at this time in our economy, i've talked to presidents in my colleges of my city, president of stanford university, why do we have the world's smartest minds come into the united states to the study, to get our ph.d.s, electrical engineering, things i can't even spell, and then we kick them out of the country as opposed to letting them stay here and become job producers. there's a whole array of pragmatic things that could grow the american economy, grow community, and we as democrats need to step up as well. one of the biggest things that frighten me, especially as my team was looking at the state's bud budget and federal government trying to figure out what's beyond in the future is the incredible cost of health care. 17% of our gdp being spent on health care expenses and growing

even more so. squeezing out investment in research, squeezing out investment in education, squeezing out investment in infrastructure. >> just not sustainable. >> it's not sustainable. >> mayor booker, health care, you bring up a good point to our transition here, but thank you very much. we're going to follow what you say at today's no labels event. >> looking forward to it. >> some health insurance companies are raising their rates over 25%. perhaps we need health care law passed. former white house adviser on health policy, dr. zeke emanuel, joins us ahead on "morning joe." it's a new day.

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up next -- >> do we have him? >> i know you've been waiting. you have been waiting. >> i've been waiting all week. >> everyone's been waiting. >> for a week. i never saw him last week. that's what put me in a bad mood at the end of the week. >> up next, the rattner charts. steve will give us a reality check on where the fiscal cliff deal left the deficit. keep it right here on "morning joe." ♪

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welcome back to "morning joe." 43 past the hour. a live look at the white house. time now for "morning joe" economic analyst steve rattner and his charts. >> he's got a chart of the white house, if you're at a social event -- >> yeah. >> -- and you have al roker problems. so let's go ahead and get that graphic up right now. >> no. >> get the actual restroom that al had to run to. >> they do have a lot of social events at the white house. >> roker's become a verb, to roker. >> he just rokered himself. >> all right, steve. why don't you take us through your charts. deficit reduction enacted so far, why we care. >> so a little bit of an update on where we are because eventually congress is going to come back in a week or so and try to deal with the next fiscal cliff, and it's useful to talk about where we came from. so most people judge deficit reduction going back to when simpson-bowles' report came out and we meshed from there and what's happened. there's actually been several

rounds of deficit reduction worth reviewing. back in 2010 and '11, they put a bunch of continuing resolutions or kind of spending caps onto mostly discretionary programs. in 2011 when we had the debt ceiling debacle, they agreed to the budget control act which was another billion dollars, roughly, of cuts. again, mostly from if not entirely from discretionary programs. and then, of course, we had the fiscal cliff which was $650 billion of revenue increases. so so far, we've actually had $2.4 trillion over a ten-year period of deficit reduction. but about 30% of it has come from rev lienue increases and at the other 70% from come from spending cuts. entirely from discretionary programs. >> what's the budget control act? >> it's what came out of the last debt ceiling debacle when the republicans and the democrats agreed on this trillion dollars of roughly discretionary -- all discretionary spending reductions. but the point is, none of this

really touches entitlements. none of it touches the mandatory. and its $2.4 trillion. >> where is the sequestration in these numbers? >> it's not in here yet because it hasn't happened yet. this is sort of where we are today. this next graph shows you how budget wonks measure our progress. if we had done nothing, we would grow to 90% debt to gdp over the next ten years which everybody agrees would be a dangerous, if not disastrous, level. what we've done so far takes us to 79%. simpson-bowles would have taken us to 65% if we had enacted it, but we didn't. and i think the most realistic goal, and it's probably unattainable that any of us have at the moment is 72%. that would require another 2.4 -- i'm sorry, $1.6 trillion of deficit reduction. sequestration, to your point, joe, is $1.2 ptrillion plus interest. it would address a lot of it but in a really unbalanced way. >> of course, the problem here

and you've alluded to it several times, discretionary spending, that's not what bankrupts us. entitlements bankrupt us. it is a matter of basic arithmetic. and neither democrats nor republicans -- >> want to face that. >> -- are doing what needs to be done. >> so let me show you that. because you're exactly right. so this is a long-term breakdown of how the budgets work. if you go backwards, the sort of greenish color is discretionary spending. it went up because of the wars. it went up because of the stimulus. but then it's just going to get squeezed out into the budget by this guy up here, which is health care spending. >> medicare and medicaid. >> to a lesser extent down here, social security are just squeezing everything else out of the budget, squeezing out education, r&d, infrastructure. >> these numbers are very important because you talk to americans, and they haven't really focused on this. you look at the blue line, it's social security. so you hear people talking about how we've got to take care of the long-term debt with social security. that's not the main driver of it. it's not even close.

you make minor adjustments in social security, and social security's going to be fine. you look at the green line, again, this is everything else. this is education. this is defense. this is infrastructure. this is r&d. this is everything. these are all of our investments. that line goes way down. >> so what's the plan? >> the red line, man, it is medicare and medicaid. that cripples us. >> look, the rattner plan is a no labels plan. everybody realizes that it can't be done one way or another. you can't turn medicare into a voucher plan and tax the rich to pay for it. means testing, benefits, things like that that will gradually put it into a box. >> you have to agree on it. rattner, thank you very much. up next, the "morning joe" football frenzy. >> whatever happened to your first name? >> how about mister? >> i mike financier. >> he is a financier. >> roger bennett up next. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. i was overweight my whole life.

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roger. >> roger bennett, a rough weekend for liverpool.

>> a great weekend for football. manchester united against liverpool. been rivals since the days of the industrial revolution. liverpool and john henry have fallen through the ice a little bit. rivalry has become one sided and so it seemed in the first half when manchester united, van persie -- >> what goal, man. >> 17th goal of the season. doubled the lead just after halftime. this looked like a rivalry of a u.s.a. against the soviet union. liverpool responded like a wounded dog. they fought back and then -- gave you hope. it's always the hoot that kills you. >> it really is. >> 2-1. this game was relatively ugly at times. it was hard to watch, but you

just couldn't tear your eyes away. >> roger bennett. >> put pressure on city to respond their rivals. manchester city. they travel to london. travel to arsenal, a place that mika knows. >> exactly. >> won the game when this gentleman missed the penalty. didn't take long for manchester city to get on the score sheet. james milner defied physics, mediocrity and basic englishness. >> oh, my goodness. >> couldn't do that again if he tried. city, 1-0 ahead.

and this gentleman, deko, he shows up with a message on his shirt. kept pace. seven points behind united. >> man u.'s on their way to another championship, aren't they in. >> it's looking that way at the moment. anyone can beat anyone. there's always hope. >> where is liverpool? they aren't even there. >> we have to go down some and then down some again. this is a fallen giant. >> what has happened here? it was ugly. mistakes were made. >> mistakes were made. it happens. >> last year this year. i think they've got a great manager. i think they should keep branson, right? >> visionary or medicine man. >> he needs more good people. >> americans have come over,

they see a great investment opportunity, but they're all fumbling through the trap doors of english football. >> arsenal. >> roger bennett. >> all right. >> thank you very much, roger. as always. coming up, tough words for his own party. why he says republicans need some self-examination. we're back in just a moment with much more "morning joe." [ indistinct shouting ] ♪ [ indistinct shouting ] [ male announcer ] time and sales data. split-second stats. [ indistinct shouting ] ♪ it's so close to the options floor... [ indistinct shouting, bell dinging ] ...you'll bust your brain box. ♪

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only at the golden globes do the people beautiful of film rub shaulers with the rat face people of television. >> first two movies took place in boston, but he move third-degred this one to iran. >> hunger games was one of the best films of the year and also what i call the six weeks to get me into this dress. >> and the life of pie, the six weeks after i take this dress off. >> good morning. it's 8:00 on the east coast. time wake up, everyone, as you take a live look at new york city. welcome back to "morning joe." back with us onset, we have steve rattner, mike barnacle and

zalik. >> you had colin powell on "meet the press." >> that was good. start with that. that was fantastic. >> then of course, your biggest event of the weekend. miss america. very excited. miss alabama. is alabama going to win everything? >> she's not from alabama. >> actually from brooklyn. >> i didn't watch that. i watched the golden globes, but didn't watch miss america. donald trump call me though and said me secret desire in life was to be a beauty queen. >> "huffington post" had this article about all the things these women did, like duct tape. >> bad enough being on -- >> they use duct tape and then miss west virginia used butt by the way, would have come in

handy for al roker when he went to the white house. >> what did they do at the golden globes? anything? >> i don't know, but you should always -- we should all be in trouble. always carry butt glue with you. let's turn the page. >> that happened. >> he took a gamble. played craps and lost. >> what's wrong with you? >> the playoffs. >> what about those falcons? before the falcon, what about john fox and the broncos? >> oh, my gosh. >> got 30 seconds left. he's got a time-out. got peyton manning at quarterback and they take a knee? are you kidding me? >> my dad, from the time i was 9 years old, he kocoached me in football. it's the keystone cops. the end of the game.

from the time i was 9 years old playing on his football teams, he said the same thing. deep within the deepest man and here they are in the nfl playoffs, end of the game and they look, what are these guys doing? tell me -- that's the end of the game. it's unbelievable. falcons, big shocker, seahawks were supposed to win it all. pete carroll is a college coach trying to ice the kicker. calls time-out just before the field goal attempt. field goal misses. he would have won the game if you aren't a college coach. >> atlanta gets a home game. >> against a great san francisco team and man, san francisco's quarterback is just absolutely out of his mind. ran for 180 yards or so? >> 188 yards. >> like he was chasing a car down a highway, what somebody said. he makes a new model for what it should be. >> absolutely. and then the golden globes. >> bradley cooper.

i actually saw his movie and did not walk out. it's really good. it's one of those movies that gets better after you left and you start thinking about it. that, to me, is a sign of -- wonderful. he got ripped off. really great. >> just amazing. >> argo won. >> that was great. i thought that worked. i actually watch ewatched. jennifer lawrence won. definitely. >> she was wonderful. >> really good. >> actress from "zero dark thirty" won. >> which i haven't seen yet. and the hosts were amazing. >> they were incredible. >> oh, and "les mis." i've never seen more movies this year and i'm going to stay in them. if you'd like to join me, i'm going to have "morning joe" must see movies. >> "les mis" won.

>> go to the movies, 10:30 in the morning, get it out of the way. >> you know what they call that? >> and then to the park. >> only problem is i'll see you there. >> and have dinner right afterwards. >> instead of selling you the can candy, they smell doans pills and the place smells of ben-gay. it's total abuse. >> apparently, her role, she talked about how she prepared for it and she said she went to a very dark place and stayed there. >> did that sound familiar? >> yeah. >> did you watch the entire -- >> i did that last week. >> yes, you did. i apologize to you for that. i went from going to a dark

place and staying there and i'm sorry about that. you didn't deserve it and i have made, like you, made a new year's resolution. got to see more movies. i made three. one, i'm not going to do bad ever again. >> that's good. i don't know if anyone knows what you're talking about, but that's okay. >> i'm just kind of -- i was in a bad place thursday and friday. two, i think this is important, too. i'm going to try to interrupt you less in the new year. >> that won't happen. >> and three, the next time we go to the white house, i'm going to try very hard not to poop my pants. >> i bank on one and two. >> what about interrupting the rest of us? >> it's got to be "morning joe." >> all right. fine. we're good. let's do the news. >> oh. whoa. >> snap. can we move on? >> yes, we can. >> former secretary of state colin powell was on "meet the press" over the weekend offering some tough words to his own party. take a listen.

>> there's also a dark, a dark brand of intolerance in some parts of the party. they still sort of look down on minorities. how can i evidence that? when i see a former governor say that the president is shucking and jiving, that's a racial era, slave term. when i see another former governor after the president's first debate where he didn't do very well, said that the president was lazy, he didn't say he was slow, tired, he didn't do well. he said he was lazy. now, that doesn't mean anything to most american, but to those of us who are african-americans, the second word is shiftless. birther, the whole birther movement. while senior republican leaders tolerate this kind of discussion in the party. i think the party has to take a look at itself.

i think the republican party right now is having an identity problem and i'm still a republican. but in recent years, there's been a significant shift to the right and we have seen what that shift has produced. to losing presidential campaigns. i think what the republican party needs to do now is take a very hard look at itself and understand that the country has changed. the country is changing demographically and if the republican party does not change along with that demographic, they're going to be in trouble. >> the next story we're about to do on gun control is a part of this conversation, but first, joe, how important is what colin powell said? i mean, he has endorsed president obama in the past. he has shown frustration in the party and it's not like he is mitch mcconnell or someone else saying we need to change. isn't he in a different category or is this significant? >> it's extraordinarily significant because yes, he

supported barack obama. but there are a lot of other republicans that are required for a majority. that are required for republicans to win the white house, that are a lot like colin powell that just look at the republican party and think they've lost their way. i've got to say, if you look at how the republican party acted the first time president obama was elected, i wrote a book that basically to be boiled down to don't lose your al roker at the white house. >> exactly. >> they didn't listen. they went out. engaged in birtherism, called the president a racest and went so far right and extreme that they lost middle america. and so lost the presidential election. look at the cover of drudge,

which i think magnificently reflects the feelings of conservatives. where the conservative movement is. he linked stories people wants to see and does it better than anybody else. this weekend, i went on drudge and at the top of it, it's a story of survivalists. that are buying property, arming themselves and building walls out west. you have shawn hannity, who is talking about succession. you have another talk radio host, who's name isn't even worth mentioning, that is talking basically about, about how the federal government is congresswom coming in and taking weapons. there's a call to arms. and they're going even more extreme right than they were four years ago. this is such a recipe for disaster for the republican party. i thought i would never say it, but if this party continues on

this trajectory over the next three years, then we're going t continue on this trajectory and i think the republican party ceases to be a player in presidential politics. when a guy like colin powell says i'm a republican and he's been saying this for years, and the republican party has been pushing him away. every time i talk ed about how our foreign policy should be like colin powell's foreign policy for five, six year, even before he endorsed barack obama the first time, i would get attacked for associating with colin powell's very conservative with a small "c," realist approach that republican presidents followed for years. it was the weinberger doctrine, powell doctrine and suddenly, it became the doctrine of lefties?

>> colin powell is a self-identified republican and has been for many, many years and with with each passing year and election cycle, republican party, too many within the republican party, try to further estrange him from the republican party platform, from much of what is said publicly by a lot of republicans. colin powell's also a guy who has the ability and the belief that a lot of republicans, not a lot, too many republicans and too many democrats don't have. he has the ability and the belief to put country ahead of party and that's unfortunately something that's passe in washington. >> the problem though is there are, we're here in new york. we're washington or boston or l.a. and the conversation's going to be different than out in the rest of the country, where if you saw on the front page of t"the new york times" oe the weekend, they're out buying

guns. >> we're seeing the party just splinter in several different ways. >> that's pressure on the party. >> it is. he made a great point that the party can't lose its grip on what's happening demographically in this country. this is a tremendous deal. this is not just the party of the wealthy, he said, and of lower taxes. it has to be you know, many of these, many republicans don't make as much money and pay a much higher percentage of their income in taxes and they need to party's help, too. that was such a potent what was it, 30 minutes? >> it really was. yes, gun sales are moving. a lot of people are are buying two or three. >> as many as they could get. >> you can't have enough of those clips, right? i guess. >> apparently not. >> maybe they string them around their christmas trees. but steve rattner, this is the

problem the republican party has made. they listen to the loudest voices. a small, small percentage. of americans. and americans, by the way, who don't swing presidential elections. i have been saying it for four years and making extremist conservatives very upset. you don't just look at what the most conservative person in northwest florida's going to do when they're voting. if you want to win the white house, you ask what's going to happen in bucs county, pennsylvania. in the suburbs of philly. what's going to happen to i-4 corridor? what's going to happen in columbus, ohio? republicans chasing survivalists and the wayne lapierre fringe of the republican party, not the nra. that's just such a losing

formula. >> everything you said is completely true and i can't disagree with it. it's a recipe for zdisaster. some kind of thelma and lewis exercise where they're trying to take the party over the clip. the colin powell performance was quite extraordinary. just how he so calmly, clearly, logically, from a, to b, c, laid out everything you just said in terms of how the republican party has moved. there are a couple of other things about the interview worth noting. he is still fighting the battles of the bush administration where he had the more sensible position. and he also has this particular ability to look at the situation as somebody who is a member of the minority and feels this hostility toward him from the rest of the party in part because he is a minority. but just to finish on a more optimistic note, joe, while at the moment, it is impossible to point to any sign in the

republican party they're taking to heart the kinds of things colin powell is saying, you do remember that parties do have this tendency to self-correct. >> coming up next, rate hike. despite the new health care laws, some health care insurers are raising rates by over 25%. the reasons behind the increases and what can be done about it. that's next with dr. emanuel. also ahead, the first asian american to congress. congressman grace meng. but first, bill karins. good morning. the weather around the country, very diverse. i mean, we got cold, snow, we got rain and unusually warm, foggy conditions in new england. just kind of a big weather map with all our winter extremes out there. thankfully, the fog's beginning to lift. still a little bit in philadelphia. about 15 to 30-minute airport delays, but the northeast is starting to look better along

with new york and d.c. watch out virginia and north carolina, you will get rain today. look at the white popping up just outside of dallas. some sleet and light snow reported, not in dallas, but just to the east side of town. that's going to head across arkansas. memphis, tennessee, you're going to have some freezing rain to deal with this afternoon. the cold air. the east coast is crazy warm, but it is the middle of the winter cold from billings to minneapolis. west, brutal. wyoming, minus 23 windchill and it's cold by arizona standards. phoenix has a windchill of 30. vegas, 17. so not exactly great for all the snow birds who decided to head down there this week, so today's forecast, we're usually cold on the west coast. although it is sunny. the east coast, enjoy one more warm, very mild day. and then winter will begin to return as we go throughout this week. no major snowstorms for anyone as we go throughout the country. you want to see what fog looks

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meryl streep is not here. she has the flu. i hear she's amazing in it. >> she steals it. >> welcome back to "morning

joe." there is a flu epidemic, which we're going to talk about. here with us now, former white house adviser for health policy, dr. ezekiel emanuel. that's all it says? >> speaks for himself. >> his introe is usually like eight pageses. >> we're going to talk about the flu and health policy. but you know, now that this policy stuff will get done because, well, the president doesn't each out, as you've said and all of you have said, he's socially just not interested. >> he's an island in himself. and it's really been kind of a narrative, actually. the people think he doesn't want to reach out. talk about policy. >> the thing is, it is a multilayered relationship and i'll be the first to admit. if you invite somebody -- >> that's a great time to get

there, shake hands. you know, a couple of weeks ago, the president invited republicans over. mitch mcconnell, john boehner, a lot of republicans over for the screening of "lincoln" at the white house. not a single republican showed up. >> it's hard. >> those are the times when you get together, that's when you know, teddy kennedy and george w. bush, when tip o'neill and ronald reagan got together and built the friendship, or at least the respect, so when things got bad, you could pick up the phone and say hey, listen, we got to do this for the american people. >> but i think everyone on the policy side believes we're going to have to have some con strangt of health care cost going forward. there's been a lot of talk in washington of hundreds of billions of dollars over ten years.

>> every policy person agrees this has to be done. but remember, 7% of tea party members do not want to cut medicare. so what the policy option is and what actually is going to happen. >> we have a debt problem and a deficit problem and we're going have to address that or -- bad things will happen. >> do we address it now or -- >> we had an election to address it. >> the problem, republicans and democrats are willing to cut as long as it's discretionary spending, education, rnd, infrastructure, as long as as it's investments. they will not cut from the red line. they will not slow down the rate of growth from the red line. for medicare and medicaid, the two drivers of our long-term debt. not our deficits, but our long-term debt. >> i do think there are ways of cutting. that actually modernize the system and make it function much better. >> a lot of people are -- >> how? >> well, cut -- my number one

example is we have to pay differently. we know this to be true. right now, we pay fee for service. doctors get paid more for doing more. if you don't take out prostate, you don't make any money. so you have to them out prost e prostat prostates, whether necessary or marginal. we have to pay doctors to keep patients healthy and out of the hospital. that is going to be the most important thing they could do. that would modernize the system. similarly, medicare needs to pay ou they're buying things differently. no one, on the left or the right, thinks that government price setting is a good idea. we need more of a competition on prices. >> but in the current debate about what to do between the two sides, neither of those two idea ss in the discussion. it's not a discussion with boehner and obama and reid and joe biden sit down. >> no, they're going to agree how much are we going to cut and then the policy people are going

to see where and how. that's how it goes in washington. >> before you get to washington, how do you dweel patient demand? you have all of these new machines and technology. you go in, you're a reasonably healthy person. you say, hey, i want to use the new machine that gives you an echo cardiogram. the doctor says, no, you're fine, and you get one. >> there are two, mike, i think that's a great question. two issues there. where do patients get these ideas and why do they do it? in part, doctors are fuelling that and drive down the new jersey turnpike, what do you see? hospital after hospital. we've got cyber knife. the robot. this. we're fuelling patients demand. the second thing -- >> what does the di vinci robot do? >> i'm sure you don't. it's the four arm robot that does prostate surgery. >> those guys actually don't like me because i keep saying this. it costs about 4 or 5,000 more

per surgery. for a surgeon to get really good at it, requires 700 operations. >> let's talk about something people aren't going to want to talk about. you may disagree here. even when you talk about needing the slow down the rate of growth, medicare and medicaid, i hope we do it the way you're talking about, they'll say we're just going to take from the providers, the doctors. that's not a reality because if you don't take from beneficiaries, then what's going to happen is and people need to know this. you're going to have a two tier system. you're going to have doctors that are going to opt out of medicare and basically, medicare is going to become medicaid for senior citizens, so we're going to have to have a balanced approach to protect beneficiaries. >> this may shock you, joe. i actually agree with you. those are called meat ax approaches. >> all you do is drive the

providers out of the system. >> it's bad for earn. it also leads to cost shifting so yes, they're now going to lose money on medicare and they're going to charge more. >> the cuts in medicare have largely been out of the provider. >> and you have doctors now, this is important and it's a little nuance, but americans need to understand this because it's easy for politicians to say we're only going to take it from doctors, hospitals, because they're rich. if they continue to squeeze the doctors, then at some point, they're going to say i can do this operation on the back and i've got a guy working with me, two board certified guys, we're going to work two hours on spinal surgery, get paid $2500. i'm going to opt out of medicare and i'll have a guy come in who can pay me 20,000 for the same operation and i'll completely opt out of medicare.

>> two things. the first is that many proposals including some of the left, which i helped write, are proposing that we do in fact change premiums for better off medicare beneficiaries, so they pay more. that's an important factor. there is talk about changing how you do deductibles and other things so that people have an incentive to save. i would say that the other thing, joe, a lot of this whacking, you know this better than anyone, is because of complicated, nd the beltway politics. when you score, the cbo says is this going to save or not. whacks work great and mode modernizati modernization, they don't give a lot of credit to. i'm hopie inine inine ining pol to talk about the long haul.

>> insurance rates, why are they going up? >> the fact we're now going to have real competition in the exchanges and rates are going to come down and i think they're -- >> but they're going up a lot. >> i agree with you. it's in anticipation of this dramatically changed marketplace and i think that's what they're doing. they're sort of, everyone is sort of well, we don't know what the future is, let's lock in as much money as we can. >> but these are generally state regulated, aren't they? aren't the regulators pushing back? >> the force by which some states regulate, regulate is a loose term. they review them, but not all of them have the power to roll them back. remember, insurance rates are set by many things. how risky the population is, but also by how much hospitals and doctors are charging and when they're prices go up. overall inflation in the health care system, since 2005, has actually come down substantially. that is very, very important.

and i think it's gotten almost no play. we actually have seen health care inflation come down since 2005, it's been growing less than 1% over gdp. >> that's a very good sign. >> there was a report last week that it grew 3.9%. so why are insurance rates going up 23%. >> they're particular segments. they're not going up for big employers that fast and i said, there are two reasons. one is this uncertainty about next year, they're trying to lock in high rates an the second is that there are, it's for a segment, which is more risky. smaller businesses and individuals, not for big employers. where the pricing is a little smoother. >> before you go, how about is this flu emergency? >> wow. >> how bad? >> a lot of people are sick. >> first of all, we've had it early, so we're seeing it earlier than usual and second of all, this strain, the kind of flu it is, it's calling h3n2 is

the bad variety. causes a lot of sickness and we haven't seen this since 2004, 2004. the most important thing you can tell your audience, joe, what is it? get a flu shot. >> i actually got one. >> only about 35 to 40% of people, you got to get one. >> we should do it on the show tomorrow. do it on the show tomorrow. yeah. >> will you give me a shot tomorrow? >> do you have one? >> if you want me to get you one, we'll figure it out. >> i got my whole family flu shots, but forgot to get one. >> it's very, very important for the public and you should do it on the air to show people it is really painless. >> alex, can you make that happen? >> sure thing. sfl doctor, thank you so much. >> nice to be back. happy new year to everyone. >> say hello to the other doctor, ari. who continues to give us medical advice every day. >> two articles a day from him about what to do.

>> about most are about aspect. >> ari. coming up, she didn't want to run for office in the first place, now, she's new york's first asian american congresswoman. grace meng joins us next on "morning joe." ♪

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possibly several months. so, if the duck isn't able to work, how will he pay for his living expenses? aflac. like his rent and car payments? aflac. what about gas and groceries? aflac. cell phone? aflac, but i doubt he'll be using his phone for quite a while cause like i said, he has a fractured beak. [ male announcer ] send the aflac duck a get-well card at getwellduck.com.

welcome back. >> okay. 37 past the hour. joe's talking about his fabulous -- it was -- what was your view outside the window? >> beautiful view. >> that's nice. >> it was up from pink floyd. >> our next guest got a better office. democratic congresswoman from new york, grace meng. it is great to have you on the show. congratulations. >> thank you. thanks for having me. >> are you discouraged yet? >> i'm not. i have an office that faces sun light. >> that is very good. very good. so, you took gary ackerman's

spot. >> i did. >> so, how's it going? what was the first couple of weeks like? >> we had a couple of weeks of or wrennation, getting ready to settle down and getting an apartment that's about this big. i live i think in worst conditions than i did in college, but that's okay. >> you have two little ones. >> i do, i do. >> how old are they? >> 3 and 5. >> oh, my goodness, you have your hands full. >> so, any surprises yet? or is it what you expected? >> well, it's been nice because the freshman class is a relatively large class. a class of about 84 members and it's been nice because people throughout the country, regardless of which party they're in, they really want to see congress function better. >> have you actually talked to republicans? >> we have. there are a lot of people to remember their names, but we have had opportunities during orientation. >> i want to ask you about what your issues are going to be and what you hope to get

accomplished there, but first of all, have you received any advice from other members of congress on how to do what you're doing and how to survive? >> well, the new york delegation has been wonderful. they've given me advice on small issues to larger issues. a lot of it is to stay true to my district and get back as often as i can, so that's something that i hope i can continue to do. >> mike? >> i guess the question is you're the daughter of immigrants. why? why did you want to run for congress? after everything we read and hear every day. everything that's in the papers about the dysfunction. >> people are a little discouraged with congress. >> 9% approval rating. you could have been a dictator from venezuela. >> or a cockroach, i think. it is very discouraging, but

even more so, why we need to get involved. if you knew me growing up in queens, i was a shy did. i did not like to talk a lot in class. i was never part of student government. but as i became a lawyer and realized that i, as a daughter of immigrants, are growing up in a diverse area like queen, have a to offer and i want to use my skills. if it's evoking those elementary school skills of helping people get along and get the job done, it's something that i want to do. >> talk about the hurricane sandy relief bill. you introduced a bill, you're going to do that today, did i just walk all over your announcement? >> not at all. we're introducing an amendment today basically that requiring that houses of worship affected by hurricane sandy be included in the financial aid package and that they are able to get reimbursed, too. houses of worship serve many people throughout the year,

regardless of their religion. >> and so, the fikt over the sandy bill, you're going to do this today. are you encouraged, hopeful that it will go through or is it going to get bogged down in crazy politics? >> i'm always hopeful. but the government did this during hurricane katrina, so it's important to at least raise the issue. >> you've made history. the first american asian to get elected into congress. pretty surprising coming from new york state. >> right. >> that it's taken that long. >> right, right. new york is sort of behind in some areas in government and politics. i was the only asian in the state legislature as well. >> really? >> okay. we're glad you're here. thank you so much, congresswoman meng. good luck with your family. that's going to be a challenge, but it gets easier. are they both boys? >> two little boys. >> they're adorable.

>> up next, this morning's business headlines with brian sullivan. we'll be right back. [ female announcer ] going to sleep may be easy, but when you wake up

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it's time for business before the bell with brian sell van. what's happening on wall street today? >> paying attention to the state of michigan because that is where ben bernanke is going to be giving his speech at 4:00 p.m. eastern time today. that's going to be the focus of the macro picture for the street. the last time the fed minutes came out, b there was some clues that perhaps the fed was willing to tighten interest rates before

they said they would earlier. that spooked people. we've seen a lot of money come in to stocks. people leave other asset classes, your 401(k) plan goes up. ahead of that, the attention is going to be on apple. there are reports out this morning that apple has cut orders for components to the iphone 5 like the screen. the reason that's bad, pretty clear. if you don't think you're going to sell a lot of stuff going forward, you don't order more to make more. that has shares down almost 3% this morning. they could fall below 500 bucks a share. we're seeing the futures really flat. but apple's the big corporate story. >> steve rattner, what's the matter with apple? >> i've got my opinion. i'm sorry to jump in, guys, which has nothing to do with the phone or whatever. it has to do with the charger. if you've got an iphone 4, you probably have 30 of those charges in your car, your home,

travel. >> ipad. >> you've got to buy the new charger. >> first of all, the iphone is half of apple's business. we think of it as a computer company, a music company, it's a phone company and a very high priced phone company. those phones cost 6, $700 and people are simply not going to pay that around the world, which is where they need to go next with them because they're pretty saturated in the u.s. >> but steve jobs would not have done that trick with the phone charger. >> no planning at all. you still can't get a car charger for the iphone 5 in an apple store. >> and you take your iphone 5, if you have a device, they're all geared to iphone 4. again, absolute nonsense. >> i just switch edswitched. i left the iphone 4 and went to the galaxy note. >> you're not o only one. the galaxy s phone has sold more than 100 million around the

world. samsung is breathing down your neck. >> i want to be able to see it. >> it's not cool. >> what do you mean? >> wait one second. >> are you getting your personal e-mail? >> i've got to make a call. >> i love it. >> but the great thing you can do, you can type by swiping along the keyboard. you don't have to hunt and peck. you can swipe along and text. if you break that, you're buying a new one. >> you do that to the iphone, it cracks into a million pieces. >> i'm going to sound even less cool. i got a demo for the nokia lumia, it's the best phone i've ever used. nobody's buying it. there's not a lot of ap prk s for it. but it is intuitive. >> and the blackberry's coming. the it's supposed to be pretty good.

the phone that brian is using, just talking about, it's a wall phone. >> i want that. >> this looks great. >> thank you so much. memorable moments from last night's golden globe awards straight ahead. tina fey and amy poehler. >> they were fantastic. ♪

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haven't really been following the controversy over "zero dark thirty," but when it comes to torture, i trust the lady who spent three years married to james cameron. >> anne hathaway, you gave a stunning performance. i have not seen someone so totally alone and abandoned like that since you were on stage with james franco at the oscars. >> funny. they were really good. >> they were really good. tina fey and amy poehler, who impressed as co-hosts last night. here were some big winners. ben affleck's "argo." best motion picture drama award.

also won best director, a category for which he wasn't even nominated. will ferrell and kristen whig presented jennifer lawrence for her role in silver linings playbook, but before they did, they swore they watched every movie in the musical or comedy category. >> "salmon fishing in the yemen." >> always beautiful. >> amazing. when the salmon are coming out -- >> comes out -- >> and when the bad guy comes -- >> the salmon's like -- and you know -- >> yemen. >> when you're in yemen. >> oh, my gosh. love jennifer lawrence. >> silver linings -- >> playbook. >> playbook. and the silver, i thought it was an animated film.

>> for tv, "homeland" was a big w winner along with best actor and actresses awards. >> have you seen the end of the season yet? >> i have. absolutely. >> what did you think? >> it's tough to sustain this thing as you go from season to season. i thought the end was a little contrived and we'll see what happens. >> i was shocked that saul did not get best supporting actress. he is unbelievable. >> that's a lot of good -- how he did not win that. >> up next, what, if anything did we learn today? we have travel issues today,

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